Business trips
To all other forum subscribers, what's been your experience of business travel? I don't mean those for whom travel is the defining feature of their job, e.g. Lonely Planet guidebook writers, freelance salespeople etc. I mean people like me who work 9-17 in offices for whom a couple of nights away is a real break from routine.
In my office the amount of travel required of people varies enormously. On the one hand there are the Research scientists who (if you believe the hype) are constantly swanning around the world to present results at conferences. Whereas in Development, where I've worked since joining the office six years ago, it's a bit haphazard who gets to go on business trips. Some people, even if they don't speak a word of a foreign language, just happen to fall into projects where they get to go on all-expenses-paid trips abroad where they can network to their hearts' content. I, on the other hand, despite attending French and German conversation classes at lunchtime, have never travelled further afield than London.
It's all the more galling that I've twice had my hopes raised that I was in line for a business trip. The first time this happened was quite early on. In November of my first year in the job, just before I did a five-week residential course, my line manager L said he'd like to consider me for a conference in Portland, Oregon the following May. He made it sound a cert, so much so that I went as far as mentioning it to my parents and in some of the Christmas cards I sent that year. Then when I was back in the office after Christmas, I asked L to confirm the date of the Portland trip, and he looked embarrassed and said, "But we decided who was going to Portland long ago! Not you!" - apparently the decision had been made during the residential course but no-one had had the decency to inform me.
By this time I had a new line manager S, with L becoming my second review manager. It was S to whom I decided to disclose my Asperger's. I mention this here because one for S's recommendations for "reasonable adjustments" was that I be excluded from business trips as I didn't present a favourable impression - a recommendation supported by L. I was hurt and objected to being marginalised. L said: "You don't learn to swim by jumping in at the deep end", to which I said, "No, but you don't learn to swim by staying away from water either!"
The second time I had my hopes raised happened a year later. In my annual review with my second review manager (still L) I'd put down "to gain international experience" in the career aspirations box, and L said he would definitely consider me for a forthcoming conference in France. I heard nothing more until I overheard that one of my room-mates (who, incidentally, didn't speak French) had been chosen instead of me, or to be precise I overheard her booking her flights. On further investigation I learned that L had no authority to make such a promise. He had a bit of a reputation for promising first and checking the budget restraints afterwards. I was livid, as much as with myself for falling for it as with the boss.
Back in my present existence, I've recently had an assessment by a rep from KeyLearning (http://www.key4learning.com), among whose recommendations is that I be moved to a new post within the office. So I've been having discussions with HR's diversity advisor about my skills and interests. I have mentioned the business trips issue, albeit tentatively, because I don't want to come across as grasping, childish, whatever. Common sense would dictate that it's better to go for a job that's enjoyable on a day-to-day basis rather than a less enjoyable job with the odd freebie trip thrown in from time to time. Indeed, if I wasn't enjoying my day-to-day job, and hence not performing to full capacity, chances are I'd be even less likely to be considered for any jolly junkets - sorry, business trips.
And then there are the colleagues who assure me that business trips are no big deal really, nothing to get envious about, that at the end of the day they are about work, not holidays - which brings me back to the title of this thread!
I suppose my attitude towards business travel is coloured by my recent experiences of leisure travel (where, in the absence of any circle of friends, I'm forced to go on organised group holidays with total strangers, and each time hope against hope that we might keep in touch after the break). I can't help but think it must be so great to travel with people you already know and have something in common with, even if it's only your work. And it must be great to know people outside of the workplace who can understand your job.
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Would love to hear your thoughts on this subject.
Kind regards
Malcolm
it just gets worse
"Back in my present existence, I've recently had an assessment by a rep from KeyLearning (http://www.key4learning.com), among whose recommendations is that I be moved to a new post within the office."
That "present existence" was nearly three years ago. HR did not move me because they said they couldn't do managed moves. Last autumn a new boss arrived who put me on a formal improvement plan which (to cut a long story short) I failed. The manager has been asking around on my behalf for a new post, but even now I can only move by applying for an advertised vacancy. HR cannot and will not create a new job for me. Big Issue anyone?
Your Situation
Dear Aeolienne
Thank you for the reply and good to see you back on the forums.
There are a number of issues here which I feel may impact. Does your employer know about your AS? If so, I think I am right in saying that the HR Dept would be obliged to offer more support and assistance.
Likewise, your new manager. You don't say what the background is to him/her, but it seems that there may be an issue there.
There is also the question of why you failed the improvement plan which may not be an appropriate point of discussion in an open forum?
Without knowing more or specific details, I would personally be proactive in such a situation to protect my position and resolve the situation.
If the company/manager is unhappy with your contribution, I would specifically ask them to clarify why. If necessary, I would then seek support and, if necessary, training to overcome any areas where improvement could be made.
The key issue here for me is that you approach the situation constructively from the viewpoint of the employer. You want to (I am sure) do a good job for them, so you need their support in helping you to provide this.
Hope that this helps.
Failed improvement plan
Yes, my employer has known about my AS since 2002 (I was diagnosed the day after I started work with them, as it happens, and disclosed it a few months afterwards). There are, I'm told, about ten other employees in an organization of 1500ish with AS. Unfortunately the concept of "reasonable adjustments" is left entirely to individual managers to interpret - there is apparently no sharing of experiences, nor any official guidelines from HR.
The manager has clarified why she's unhappy with my contribution. She says I require far too much guidance, that I don't demonstrate enough initiative and intellectual curiosity, and that I'm incapable of planning my work constructively.
As for training - forget it. If there were a training route to get me out of my current job into another one within the office I would have taken advantage of it long ago, certainly not stuck around for three years. But there isn't. The only ways to move jobs are experience, experience and experience.
Incidentally, I would probably contribute to the forums more if I was notified of each time my threads are replied to, but for some reason I never receive any email notifications. Can you look into this?
Pressing for Assistance
Dear Aeolionne
I am sorry to hear about your ongoing difficulties; it must be very frustrating.
Without knowing more specific details it is difficult for me to comment further (nor would it really be appropriate either from a professional perspective or in an open forum) but I do feel you should perhaps press HR further on this.
There are legal obligations on their part and I would have thought that someone in there would be interested/receptive to trying to help you if you approached them constructively from the perspective of the company's interest.
Would be very interested also in learning who you work for if possible and of making the other people with Asperger aware of my site (hope you don't mind me asking?).
With regard to the e-mail notifications, a couple of other people have also asked about this.
I have been having some technical problems with the site for quite a while now. However, I think I am getting closer to resolving them.
Once these have been addressed I am going to look at having a number of enhancements done, one of which will be a notification system. Thank you for bringing this to my attention.
Hope very much that you will continue to visit the site going forward. You always make most useful and very interesting contributions.
Here's a clue...
"Would be very interested also in learning who you work for if possible"
It's a branch of the scientific civil service which relocated from Bracknell to Exeter in the early 2000s. I'm not in a position to inform the other people in the office about your site because I don't know who they are.
Next week I face a panel hearing to decide whether I have any future in the office.
Good Luck
Dear Aeolienne
Just wanted to say good luck with your meeting.
Can't say too much more other than I hope that it goes well. It would also encourage you to try to be assertive and - constrictively - assert your case and position and re-emphasise all your strengths.
You have much to offer the employer in question and, if they are willing to help you as they should, can make a really important contribution going forward.
Best of luck
Malcolm
That doesn't sound so good
That doesn't sound so good :(. Are you in a union? I think you ought to be entitled to have a support person with you (if you wish) so you don't have to face a panel on your own, which would be a daunting situation for anybody - let alone a person with Asperger's.
It also seems to me that they might worry about your going on a trip on your own but surely there would be some scope for a trip with one or more co-workers instead of alone?
In my job, I sometimes think it would be good to travel to one of our other offices but wouldn't feel too confident about going on my own unless I knew there would be somebody to meet me and make the arrangements for travel and accommodation.
Re: That doesn't sound so good
For those of you who do get to go on business trips, here's one way to relieve the social anxieties. If you're a woman, that is.
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/07/business/businessspecial/07NET.html?_r...
(I was dismissed as a result of the panel hearing, BTW. And yes, I am in a trade union, and they're taking my case to the civil service appeals board.)
Aeolienne, I'm very sorry
Aeolienne, I'm very sorry about that and it seems to me they were just looking for an excuse to dismiss you. I hope your union has more power to plead your case than the unions here.
(Although, don't mind me - I just am not overly impressed at the lack of support the union I am in has given me over the past few years - I was better off when in the old union but they were taken over by another one).
Re-assessment
I hope that your union is able to put forward a case for you and that things work out well.
Re-assessment?
That's one euphemism I hadn't heard for taking the case to the civil service appeals board.
There still remains the problem of applying for new jobs. If I go for similar work to what I did before, am I setting myself up to fail again? My last annual review rated me as severely lacking in analytical ability, something you would expect every maths graduate to have, and someone with Asperger's even more so. It's all very well saying I shouldn't focus on my past job, but how else can I learn the lessons that need to be learnt? Where did it all go wrong? I can't help feeling that if I'd been properly managed continuously and coherently - as in given clear, direct, honest, timely feedback, SMART targets regularly updated and a career development plan, if more use had been made of the skills I brought to the employer from my university studies rather than allowing them to rust over through lack of use - all this would have never happened. But then I would say that, wouldn't I?
Achieving Perspective
Dear Aeolionne
Firstly, I do sympathise with the difficult situation you have found yourself in.
I too have been made redundant under very difficult circumstances and know only to weel from my own experience just how frustrating and disillusioning it can be for someone with AS.
It was for the reasons you outline that I wrote my book and started this website, (it is also why I am working with Nottingham University's Careers Service to develop our Transitions Project) to help people such as ourselves who have found ourselves in these positions.
As you rightly say, there is next to now proper, relevant and beneficial support for people with AS (adults) working in the mainstream employment environment. I am passionate about trying to resolve this!
However, you are where you are and I think that needs to be recognised and dealt with.
Hard as though it is accepting that you are in this position is the starting point for future progress. What has happened has happened and you need to build on this and, as you say, take the beneficial lessons from it. Easy to say but harder to achieve I know, but there is no real alternative!
Without knowing the precise details of your exact circumstances it is difficult to say further what needs to be done. The starting point is listing what you think the key events - and potential lessons are - and then taking it from there.
Is this something you feel able to talk about in the forums? If not, perhaps you could drop me a line directly.
Good luck. Believe me, you have lots to offer - especially as a Maths graduate!
I was not made redundant, I
I was not made redundant, I was dismissed. There is a huge difference.
Business Trips for Me
I haven't taken that many business trips. Most of the off campus events have been just for the day at places not too far. I did take a trip for a few days to go to a conference over at Atlantic City but that was a few years ago.
I'm not really into business trips that much. I don't like flying or travelling by myself. I'm not really a person to plan these type of things out that well. Sometimes I feel many business trips are useless since most of the topics discussed in these conferences don't always pertain to me or my position or even my workplace. They might apply better for other places or positions.
Honestly, if I was ever told I had to attend a conference on my own and fly there or travel long periods of time I think I would reject it.
My opinions might not necessary be agreeable to everyone else's here but I figure I would put in my two sense and personal feelings on the matter.
Well, I don't take objection
Well, I don't take objection to your point of view since I wouldn't want to make all the arrangements for a business trip myself either and would prefer to travel and stay with at least one or two other people who I know from work. There is safety in numbers (usually).
Public Speaking
I have never considered formal communications training, but may well do so as I think it could be very useful.
The best training I have had in this area has, once again, been through experience and actually doing it. It suits my learning style.
In a previous position I had to do a lot of introductory speaking at events. At first I was very nervous but, once I had got over that, it became not only very easy but hugely enjoyable. It also contributed significantly to my self-confidence.
From a perspective of my Asperger, it helped overcome many of the things I found most difficult: speaking to groups, communicating to a wide audience and overcoming internal self-doubt.
The key factor for me was preparation. I need to knowmy brief, be sure of what I am saying and so confident about delivering it. Above all, I practice beforehand to ensure that I know I can achieve this.
In a month's time I am going to give a presentation at a major event at BAFTA - the main UK Television and Film body in the UK. There will be over a hundred people there and it represents a real opportunity to raise my profile. I know I can do it and I am really looking forward to it.
For those starting out I think the best approach is to try and start small: look for opportunities where you can present issues to small groups of people and don't over expose yourself initially before you feel able. This way you can gradually build up.
I would try and encourage everyone to try though - it is enormously self-confidence boosting.
Communication
It's an idea I talk about too much, but can you take a communications course somewhere? Better yet would be public speaking. Toastmasters has helped a lot of people with self-expression. It's not a matter of changing your inner self, but the way you present yourself so your bosses and coworkers won't lose the message you're trying to send.
Line manager "S" (who
Line manager "S" (who incidentally was female) left the office a year after the incident I described. Her only explanation for my "unfavourable impression" was that I had an unconventional demeanour, manner of speaking and so on, although I was nice to get to know.
I never actually said that I was enjoying my job. Perhaps my grammar failed me at that point - the sentence beginning "Indeed, if I wasn't enjoying my job" was meant as a conditional statement about hypothetical future jobs, not an affirmation.
At the time I had my hopes raised and dashed regarding Portland and France, I rememember being particularly bugged by a section in my firm's guide to competencies. Here, "JL3" is the level immediately above me.
Working with others
Staff in JL3 posts will
It's difficult to see how someone whose job never brought them into contact with people outside the office could meet the first requirement. (Someone who joined the office at the same time as me was sent to the Portland conference and got promoted to JL3 as soon as she was back. Coincidence? You decide.) Certainly it struck me as discriminatory against Aspies and anyone else who doesn't make friends easily. Maybe that was one reason why that system of competencies was dropped later on.
There have been other changes in my working life since the French trip that wasn't. Nearly three years I was managed-moved to another team, one which has virtually no dealings with external customers, so envying jet-setting colleagues isn't an issue here. But there have been other problems, namely the way my colleagues have cold-shouldered me for my weirdness, which if anything has only felt worse since my colleagues underwent Asperger's awareness training last year. Hence Key4Learning's recommendation that I be moved again - and this time my team will all be informed of my Asperger's from the outset.
Business Trips
At the risk of taking this off-topic I have a very understanding boss (I think he used to work the samaritans help desk) and he has proven himself time and again supporting other people. That said I have decided never to disclose my AS. I close to my boss and am aware of some of the "back room" discussions that take place and I have witnessed that even though people can be understanding and provide all the support necassary day-to-day if it comes to the crunch those people who are "higher maintenance" get the short straw.
Sorry horrible mixed analogies there but hopefully you understand what I'm saying.
Back to your original point. I have travelled quite a lot with work and I HATE IT! For all the reasons you can imagine xenophobia, disruption of routine etc. However I have noticed that the people who want travel the most are the least likely to get it.
I don't think it's maliciousness on behalf of management but I do think there is a sub-conscious concern that people who actively want to travel shouldn't be allowed to because their focus won't be on the work.
Diagnosis & Work Advancement
Aeolionne
The issue of diagnosis and disclosure is very relevant and will impact on other things such as the travel issue.
Whether you have a ,diagnosis or choose to divulge your condition at work, is a personal one and dependent on specific circumstances.
You don't say whether you have a formal diagnosis, but do say that you will inform your new work colleagues. From what I have read this seems as though it coud well be a good move in your case.
Like Steve who has posted before, letting colleagues know that you have AS - if you are able - can be very helpful. If people understand why you are different,in the most will make allowances for it. This "may" reduce uncertainties in the eyes of others about you, especially if you can work closely with your line manager.
The latter is for me hugely important. The three companies I have worked most successfully in have all coincided with having a supportive manager.
In your new role I would quickly seriously gauge your new superior, consider whether you feel you can trust him/her and, if so, tell them all about it and what you need to work effectively.
I am not sure if you have read any of the topics under Business, Personal & Inter-personal on my site but, if not, ones' such as Managing Your Superior and Corporate Politics would be extremely useful for any person managing you to understand. It may also be worth looking at the To Tell Or Not To Tell Forum.
Good luck.
Malcolm
Overseas Business Trips
Aeolienne I can appreciate your desire for overseas business trips. You certainly have the right to know the reasons for the withdrawal of the offer in the past. My job has involved quite a lot of overseas business trips. I generally do not look forward to them, because they involve a lot of change of routine and lots of stessful socialising with strangers. On the positive side it can be fun to drink and chat with colleagues in exotic hotels. Unfortunately, my experience is that you rarely get much of a chance to see the sights (as a tourist would). I agree with Malcolm that the most important thing is to enjoy your job. I know that some people don't agree about disclosing AS at work, but my experience is that it has helped me to partially disclose to a few colleagues and managers. These people have a better understanding of what I find difficult and I feel more able to ask for support (e.g. checking content of my emails for correct tone). If you feel you would benefit from a move then I would go for it.
Business Trips - Importance Of
Two things come to mind from reading this.
Firstly, if you have asked your line manager why he feels you did not make a "favourable impression"?
I know that it can be hard, but learning from criticism is one of the most difficult - but also the most beneficial - things going forward.
If you can ascertain this, acknowledge it and learn from it, it would be a tremendous personal development asset!
Secondly, enjoying your job is the most important thing, which is what you say you do. Travel is not "that" important; in fact, after a while it can become tedious!
If you do feel that it would benefit your career development, and is something that you like to do, I would sit down with your manager and discuss it constructively.
Key to this is identifying why it is important for you and - importantly - the company. If you can convince them of the latter I suspect that you may well be successful.
It seems to me that in this
It seems to me that in this case, disclosing your AS has held you back. The managers have decided that because of some conditions that you have that from AS you cannot possibly be considered for traveling positions. Unfotunatly, one they think you are innappropriate, that is like the axe on the board in my experience.